SAMPLE TALENT CATALYST CONVERSATION AND SUMMARY
Would you like to get some additional insights into a Talent Catalyst Conversation? This resource lets you sit in on an entire Talent Catalyst Conversation. We hope that “seeing one” will help give you the confidence to go ahead and “do one” as participant or Talent Catalyst, as well as some additional skills and insights that will support you in “teaching one” to someone else.
The following dialogue is an adaptation of a real Conversation and relates to Fran, one of the inspiring people featured in the book. You’ll see how she powered up her talent story and moved into action. In addition, you’ll see some commentary boxes that give additional insights into the process for both the participant (Fran) and the Talent Catalyst (Gary).
Fran’s story is representative and inspirational. Still, it’s important to remember that no two Talent Conversations are exactly alike. Some Conversations flow beautifully and lead people to absolute clarity and immediate action. Others seem to go in fits and starts until important openings occur. Yet others leave people in a place of contemplation rather than assertive action. We find that it works best to trust yourself and the process to come to just the right result for now.
THE BACKDROP
The following Conversation is set at a Take Charge of Your Talent workshop in a midsized service business. All of the managers and professional staff—from front-line supervisors to the CEO—attended the initial workshop, in which the Talent Catalyst Conversation was a centerpiece. The 150 attendees wanted to learn more about a fresh approach to talent development and the idea of being Catalysts for one another. The business had suffered some cutbacks at the outset of the recession and was looking for a better way to engage the untapped talent inside the organization.
THE PARTICIPANT: FRAN
We met Fran at the workshop. An effective senior analyst in the auditing department, Fran wanted to become a manager. Without prior experience in managing people, she didn’t have the credentials required of applicants for supervisory roles.
THE TALENT CATALYST: GARY
In this illustration, the Talent Catalyst is Gary. Gary had prior experience watching a Conversation. He also had engaged in a Conversation directly as a participant and in another as a Talent Catalyst for a colleague. Thus, he appreciated both roles in the Conversation. With that experience under his belt, he was willing to move to the next level and demonstrate how to be a Talent Catalyst for someone else — in this case, lots of other people.
Fran and Gary volunteered to demonstrate a Talent Catalyst Conversation in front of the large workshop crowd so that the audience could see a Conversation in action. After their demonstration of each round, the audience members paired up to do the round on their own.
THE CONVERSATION BEGINS
While the crowd looked on, Fran and Gary briefly introduced themselves to each other. Each of them had a copy of the Talent Catalyst Conversation Guide, containing open-ended questions divided into three rounds: hopes, opportunities, and actions. The Talent Catalyst Conversation Guide includes an introduction to each round and some background for each of the ten steps in the Conversation. We’ve put the introductory and background information that they would read during the Conversation into sans serif text so that you can focus on their dialogue. You’ll read occasional commentary from the authors, which is set out in boxes.
GARY: Good morning, Fran. Nice to meet you officially. I really don’t know how much help I’ll be able to be, but I promise that I’ll do my best.
FRAN: Thanks so much for trying. Taking charge of my talent really struck a chord with me, so I am eager to try this Talent Catalyst Conversation. But I must admit that I feel a little self-conscious at the front of the room.
GARY: Hey, you’re brave. But don’t worry, we’re all in this together, and I’ve been through it already. It’s painless! Is there anything you want me to know before we follow the materials in the Talent Catalyst Conversation Guide?
FRAN: Well, I’ve been working in the organization for over ten years. I’ve always been in a staff role. Right now, for example, I’m a senior analyst in the auditing department. Oh, yes, and a year and a half ago I began an evening master’s degree program.
GARY: OK. What would you like the focus of this Talent Catalyst Conversation to be?
FRAN: I’m really eager to see how I can advance in my career.
Opening Commentary
When you are a Talent Catalyst, remember to listen to the participant’s responses and reflect back to the participant what you hear. Take notes as you go, so that the participant can just relax and be present. Keep in check any impulses to give advice or tell the participant what you think ought to be done. Participants need to take charge of their own talent.
Round I: Enliven Your Hopes
This round helps the participant to focus on what’s important, consider concerns, and build confidence in the prospects for success. In short, it initiates the participant’s constructive thinking to tap the creativity and motivation to move forward.
Step 1: Connect with Your Hopes
You need energy to make positive changes in your life. When you connect with your deepest hopes (that is, your interests and aspirations about the topic you’ve chosen), the energy you produce will help you to see possibilities and opportunities around you with more clarity. You will be more likely to make sound, creative choices that lead to better use of your talents; greater personal satisfaction; and more powerful contributions to your family, community, team, and organization.
GARY: What are your hopes about your work?
FRAN: I’d like to move up in the organization. In fact, I’d really like to take on more responsibility as a manager and leader.
GARY: OK, what I hear you saying is that you hope to advance and especially want to be supervising people. Why are these hopes important to you?
FRAN: I enjoy helping people and making a difference in what I do. It’s all tied up in continuing to learn, building relationships, and getting meaningful results. I’m a people person. Of course, I work with lots of people, but I think I would feel more engaged with my job if there were leadership, teaching, and training components. At this juncture, I’d really like to be guiding others in their work and helping them to succeed.
GARY: So, you are enthusiastic about the prospect of guiding other people, and it’s about more than just moving up the organizational ladder. It sounds like you’re passionate about helping others to succeed.
FRAN: Exactly.
Commentary
Notice that Gary doesn’t have to repeat each word Fran says. He just needs to reflect the essence of what she says. At this point, he can tell he is on the right track because Fran tells him so. If he had not reflected her accurately, she easily could have corrected him. This process of reflection and checking in keeps the Conversation on track.
GARY: Ready for step 2?
FRAN: OK, ready.
Step 2: Consider Your Concerns
When we focus on our deepest hopes, our brains often attempt to protect us from harm by generating stories of concern. Ignoring them could be dangerous; yet assuming they can’t be overcome will also limit what is possible. For now, we suggest that you simply acknowledge their presence.
GARY: What’s standing between you and realizing your hopes?
FRAN: The big obstacle for me is that I haven’t had formal responsibility for supervising other people. I’ve volunteered to lead projects across departments, and those have gone well. But I haven’t been responsible for direct supervision of employees. It’s a chicken-and-egg dilemma. Most of the openings for supervisory positions I see ask that applicants already have experience in supervising other people. So it seems that I just can’t get there from here.
GARY: Tell me more. Like, what would count as supervisory experience?
FRAN: Well, I know one requirement is being able to show that I can give effective performance feedback and do performance reviews. That’s what I hear from managers, and I know that from my own experience as a staffer. I need to exhibit leadership qualities. And, of course, I’d need to have some understanding about the work of the department in which I’d be a supervisor.
GARY: Which of your concerns seems most important to address now so that you can make progress toward your hopes?
FRAN: I think it’s the performance feedback piece that needs the most attention. It’s where I feel least able to demonstrate my abilities.
Step 3: Tap Your Success Stories
We can look to the past to see how we have successfully dealt with similar concerns. Retrieving memories of past successes can provide clues to overcoming current issues, situations, or concerns.
GARY: How have you successfully dealt with concerns like these before?
FRAN: I’m thinking about my decision to start my master’s. For the longest time, I thought it would be impossible. I was totally overwhelmed by the idea of working and going to school. How could I do all the work for the degree and keep up with my job at the same time? My husband encouraged me, and so did a friend and colleague who works in the same industry but at a different firm. Both of them knew the responsibilities I was up against. My husband just kept telling me that I could do it, as long as I took it course by course. I had to take the work on in manageable chunks. And then my friend reminded me that everything I learned would be readily applicable at work and might even help me to advance. I listened to their advice, and I’m halfway through the program. I’m glad that I’m pursuing the opportunity.
GARY: You got past what you thought was an impossible obstacle, and it’s working out. What did you learn from that situation that might help you now?
Commentary
At this point, Fran twisted up her arms and legs tightly, showing that she was shutting down a little and feeling defensive. Gary didn’t leap in and try to fix it; he just listened patiently.
FRAN: I can say that I’ve pursued a big goal before by breaking down the task. I also figured out how to find ways to make what I’m learning useful for the company and what I do at work helpful for my learning. That way, my growth didn’t conflict with my job.
GARY: You found ways to resolve the possible conflict between your work and your master’s program.
FRAN: Yes—for example, I used a work situation as the topic for a school project. The professor liked the practical insights, and my supervisor read it and we talked about how to apply the recommendations on the job.
GARY: Sounds like you have success stories that can help you now.
FRAN: Yes—when you put it in that light, I do.
Round II: Expand Your Opportunities
While your success stories may provide some approaches that you can build upon, significant progress requires new growth and learning. This round focuses on growth and learning, as well as the resources and expanded hopes that will help you to develop your talent. Note that chapter 5 will help you explore these issues more deeply. For now, you are developing an outline that will focus further thinking and action.
Step 4: Identify Opportunities to Learn, Grow, and Develop
As you work toward realizing your hopes, you will have many opportunities to learn, grow, and develop. This growth may be in knowledge, skills, or inner qualities like curiosity, assertiveness, or compassion. This process is likely to be energizing and pleasurable, as it opens up fresh possibilities to express your talent more fully.
GARY: How will you need to grow, and what will you need to learn to address your concerns and realize your hopes?
FRAN: I’ll definitely need to learn more about best practices for giving people performance feedback. That’s clear. I also see that I’ll need to step out of my comfort zone in terms of asking for help and opportunities.
GARY: All right, let me see if I am getting this. You want to acquire some subject matter knowledge. And it sounds like asking for help is going to be kind of tough for you.
FRAN: Yes, I think I need to be more assertive if I want to be a manager. But I’m really feeling ready for that growth. I’ll just need some practice to boost my confidence, especially if I supervise people who have been my peers.
GARY: I see. You want to show more confidence. You want to grow into a supervisory role, and you want to be able to successfully navigate the change in relationships that it will entail.
FRAN: That’s it—that, and having the persistence to work through even the stuff that makes me uneasy.
Step 5: Use Your Resources
Resources feed our hopes. Everything we accomplish, we accomplish by using our resources: the people, places, and things that surround us and the capabilities within us. Often, concerns arise because we worry that we lack the resources to realize our hopes: “I hope to do X, but I don’t have enough of Y (time, money, connections, ideas, education, skill, space, etc.).” When we recognize the abundance of our resources, our brains respond with a sense of possibility. We are emotionally, energetically, and creatively in a great place to move into our future.
GARY: What resources do you have that can help you to realize your hopes, Fran?
FRAN: When you say “resources,” you are talking about money or time or what?
GARY: When I got this question in my Conversation, I went right to the financial part. But, yeah, “resources” means anything, anyplace, and anyone that can help you on your road.
FRAN: Let me see. In terms of people, there are the two that I mentioned before—my husband and my friend and colleague, who’s actually been giving me informal advice. I also have a professor in my master’s program who is a human resources expert. He might be a good resource. In addition, the young professionals group I joined has helped me to build relationships with managers at different businesses here in our area.
GARY: That sounds like a good start. Anything else? How about places or things?
FRAN: For places, I have the university for my master’s program. And if an office counts, a manager offered to let me shadow him in his office for a few hours a week so that I could get a feel for a manager’s work and literally see what things look like from that vantage point.
GARY: How about inner qualities you might use?
FRAN: I feel good about my interpersonal skills—and my managers have pointed out my ability to work well with people as an asset in my performance reviews. I love to learn, and I like to teach, too. I also speak enough Spanish to communicate the basics. But those really aren’t inner qualities. I think assertiveness is the most important inner quality for me to work on.
GARY: Looks like you have a lot of resources you can draw on.
FRAN: You know, I think you are right. It seems like so much more when I talk about it.
Step 6: Revisit Your Hopes
Time to check back in with your hopes. Remember, we suggested that when you connect with your deepest hopes, the energy you produce will help you to see possibilities and opportunities around you with more clarity. You may wish to revise your hopes, either by articulating them in a different way or by prioritizing differently.
GARY: Do you have some greater clarity about your hopes?
FRAN: Yes, I do. I feel that things are coming into sharper focus.
GARY: How would you express your hopes now?
FRAN: Well, I’m still interested in gaining a supervisory role and helping others to succeed. I’m also clear that I hope to become more assertive in the process. What’s shifted is that I see more resources and clearer opportunities to pursue my hopes. So my hopes feel more achievable.
GARY: I hear that your direction remains the same. And I can hear in your voice that you have more energy and confidence about your prospects for getting there.
FRAN: Yes. And, you know, I think I can move even faster than I imagined. I am definitely blessed with plenty of resources and a network of people to support me. All I need to do is ask for help. That’s really essential. I do believe that a senior leadership position could be on the horizon for me.
GARY: So, you have a bigger vision, and it feels as though leading in a broader role is now more clearly within your grasp.
FRAN: That’s it.
Round III: Energize Yourself through Actions
It’s time for action! However, before you launch off with the first idea that comes to mind, this round invites you to consider a healthy stretch you might like to make: an objective you can reach for that is challenging, without causing unproductive stress or pain. Then it proceeds to who can support you and the actions you’d like to take to get started.
Step 7: Make a Healthy Stretch
One path to engage your talents is to honestly and joyfully make a stretch. This approach loses its power if the participant undertakes a stretch out of obligation or duty. You don’t need to know in advance how you would accomplish the stretch. After this Conversation, you can follow the guidance in chapter 6 to pursue your desired stretch successfully.
GARY: What might a healthy stretch look like in your situation Fran?
FRAN: I’m not sure.
GARY: Shall I offer some thoughts?
FRAN: Sure.
GARY: Is there a way that you could begin to do what you want right now? Maybe you could find an opportunity to get a real taste of the leadership role that you’d like or to lead a team in which you could provide the performance feedback that you need for your portfolio.
FRAN: That would be great, if I had the chance. Frankly, I feel ready to jump into a supervisor position, but I don’t see how to make something like that happen.
GARY: I hear that you feel ready and need a chance. From what you’ve said, it sounds as if there may be some possibilities for you.
FRAN: I suppose, but I’m not sure. What do you see?
GARY: You mentioned that you have led projects across departments, and those have gone well. Is there a way you could demonstrate your performance feedback skills by giving people performance feedback on such projects?
FRAN: You mean just start doing what I want to be doing? Sure, I’d like that, but it may take a while for such projects to arise.
GARY: That may be so. But would you consider letting people know that you feel ready now to supervise others and would like opportunities to demonstrate that?
FRAN: That could work. It feels a little pushy.
GARY: Pushy or assertive?
FRAN: OK, you got me. Yes, assertive. I’d need to think about who would be the right people to talk with about moving forward.
GARY: OK. Let’s see.
Commentary
At this point, the Talent Catalyst can link back to the responses from previous steps. Whether the participant chooses to make a healthy stretch, and what that stretch might be, is entirely up to the participant. It’s not the role of the Talent Catalyst to tell the participant what to do or make the participant feel that there’s a stretch that he or she “ought” to take. Gary was a skilled Talent Catalyst because he could listen between the lines and hold Fran’s hopes for her. However, if you are the participant, make sure that the suggestions of your Catalyst line up with your own outlook and approach. In the end, the direction you decide to take is up to you.
FRAN: That does feel right to me. I’d like to try it.
Step 8: Enlist a Talent Fulfillment Team for Results
Imagine that you have a Talent Fulfillment Team of people who can support and inspire you. The world is full of people who can bring out your best and fill in your gaps of knowledge, skill, experience, and expertise. These can be people already in your circle and others beyond it. Think as big as you’d like. Later you can use the “Enlist Your Talent Fulfillment Team” section in chapter 6 for guidance on how to reach and engage the people you seek.
GARY: Who would be ideal to have on your team?
FRAN: A team just for me? All right, I’m going to think big. While I know that I need my manager and our department head to help me with my actions, I’d like to have the CEO of our organization, Tom, on my team. He seems genuinely interested in how people can advance in our organization. He invited me once to brainstorm with him for ideas, so I’m going to take him up on it. Another good person would be my friend who is an executive at another company. I really respect her as an advisor, and I expect that she could help me to see my situation from another perspective. I’d feel comfortable confiding in her and getting candid advice. Then there is the chair of my master’s program, the one in HR. He’d be a good subject matter expert. I definitely also want my family to be supportive of my dream. The actions I’ve listed will take some extra time and effort outside the regular workday. I need my husband and kids to be on board; otherwise, I won’t be able to do this.
GARY: You’ve mentioned people whom you already know. Is there someone you don’t know well who may be able to help you “play big” to take action?
FRAN: Let’s see. Thinking really big? I could get some ideas from the executive coach that our CEO has. The people I know who have worked with her always talk about her insights, and she has excellent connections too. Maybe once our CEO is on my team, he could introduce me. You know, speaking of CEOs, there are some female CEOs in our region who inspire me. I might network through women’s leadership groups to meet them at conferences or other gatherings. Am I stretching too far?
GARY: Seems like you have a concrete list. I’m writing down the people for your team so that you can remember to enlist the ones you already know and network to meet the ones you don’t.
FRAN: That sounds great. Thank you!
GARY: No thanks needed; they are all your ideas! Can you visualize these people cheering for you as you fulfill your hopes?
FRAN: It feels a little unreal, but I’d be ecstatic. I can see myself leading with confidence, and I can almost hear my team cheering for me.
Step 9: Target Concrete Actions
Critical to any success is taking appropriate, concrete actions. Take some small actions or make a big leap. Either way, act!
GARY: What forward-moving actions would you like to take now toward realizing your hopes?
FRAN: I’m feeling a little overwhelmed by the idea of launching into action. But I’m thinking about small steps. I could start with checking out opportunities to do a research paper for my master’s program on best practices for performance feedback. Then, I could take that information and talk with my manager about my interests and how this work would be useful to me and the organization.
GARY: You’ve identified several actions to learn about performance feedback and build your skills in ways that also will benefit your organization. I notice that those pick up on the success story you shared earlier.
FRAN: Yes, they are manageable chunks that I can do to get going. And to embrace the challenge of starting to act like a supervisor, I will let my manager and special project teams know that I want to position myself to give performance feedback in real-life settings.
GARY: I am hearing that you plan to build your knowledge and skills and start applying them.
FRAN: Exactly. I don’t need to wait to get the position I want. I want to start now to explore and enjoy the role of helping others to succeed with constructive performance feedback. But—and this is a big “but”—I need to take the work one step at a time so that I don’t get overwhelmed. When I get overwhelmed, I just shut down. I was afraid a minute ago that I wouldn’t be able to finish this Conversation.
GARY: Before we go to the next step, can I ask you what helped you to get over the mental hump and keep going?
FRAN: Besides the fact that we have 150 coworkers watching us? Seriously speaking, I went back to the image of my team, and I pictured my husband and my executive friend telling me to keep going with manageable steps. It’s as if, just by imagining it, I felt supported. That relaxed me, and I got the idea to write the research paper.
GARY: Perhaps you can come back to that method as you take actions toward realizing your hopes. Do you feel that you have a workable set of actions for now, or is there something else you want to do?
FRAN: Well, I can see that I’ll need to expand my network and get more people helping me to look for opportunities to apply my skills. I have plenty to get going.
Step 10: Reflect on Your Possibilities and Progress
Take a few minutes to digest the experience you’ve just had. As participants explore these questions with thoughtful Talent Catalysts, they often gain insights and identify opportunities and actions in the Conversation itself. For other participants, the Conversations create ripples that may require more time to demonstrate their effects.
GARY: And now, the final question for 100 bonus points. Just kidding—there are no points, but the Guide does direct me to ask, what have you gained from this Conversation?
FRAN: I believe that I’ll get out of the impossible situation where I’ve felt stuck. I feel energized and ready to roll.
GARY: What will help you to follow through on your intentions?
FRAN: Well, I was wondering if I might check in with you in two weeks to report on my actions.
GARY: Sure. I’d be delighted to hear about your progress and encourage your efforts to get a strong start.
* * *
We caught up with Fran in a few weeks. The first thing we noticed was that she was wearing brighter colors. She seemed more confident. We had a very different impression of her from that of the shy woman we saw take a seat on stage just a few weeks earlier. She told us that she was ready to make some changes and that the Talent Catalyst Conversation had given her the boost she needed to get into action. Then she showed us the summary notes she was using from her Conversation with Gary.
GARY’S NOTES FROM FRAN’S TALENT CATALYST CONVERSATION
Summary of Round I: Enliven Your Hopes
1. Hopes
Advance to a supervisory role on a track to senior leadership.
Continue to learn and build relationships.
Help others to succeed.
2. Concerns
How to demonstrate proficiency in giving effective feedback and performance reviews (critical skills necessary to supervise others).
3. Success Stories
Started what seemed like the impossible task of an evening master’s program while working full time. Learned to break it into manageable pieces and integrate school projects with day-to-day work.
Summary of Round II: Expand Your Opportunities
4. Opportunities
Learn more about performance feedback.
Develop assertiveness in asking for help in achieving goals; evolve from being a coworker to being a supervisor.
5. Resources
PEOPLE
Friend/female executive for informal advice.
Expert in human resources from master’s program.
Networking program connections.
The young professionals group.
A manager who offered to let her shadow him in his office.
Female leadership group (for networking).
PLACES
Master’s degree program.
Her office.
THINGS/INNER QUALITIES
Interpersonal skills.
Love of learning.
Love of teaching.
Basic conversational Spanish.
6. Hopes Revisited
Bigger vision of leadership opportunities and ideas to pursue them starting now.
Continue to learn and build relationships.
Help others to succeed.
Summary of Round III: Energize Yourself through Actions
7. Healthy Stretch
Begin now to behave like a supervisor by taking opportunities to give constructive performance feedback.
8. Talent Fulfillment Team
CEO of organization.
Senior female executive in outside organization.
Chair of master’s program specializing in human resources.
Family to share the dream.
CEO’s executive coach.
Female CEOs in the region.
9. Actions
Check out opportunities to do research paper on best practices.
Talk with manager about how this would be useful professionally and for the organization.
Connect with HR to gain support and opportunities.
Arrange to provide performance feedback for the team on special projects.
Let appropriate people know about wanting opportunities to supervise others.
10. Reflections on Possibilities and Progress
Sees a path around the obstacles to becoming a supervisor.
Following through on Talent Catalyst Conversation feels likely to increase use of talent and work satisfaction.
Plans to check in with Gary in two weeks to encourage accountability for a strong start.